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A Christian Treated Better on an Atheist’s Site Than Two Christian Sites


A recent post of mine to John Cedar’s YouTube website:

Messenger1 second ago

A positive thing about Lloyd (John Cedars): As a Christian I was treated better on his channel, JW Survey, than I was treated as a commenter on two Christian channels. I was a commenter on JW Survey for years. And I’d debate ideas with atheists on JW Survey up the ying yang. But never did any of Lloyd’s editors (Lloyd himself, John Redwood, or Covert Fade) silence me, insult me, or delete one of my comments.

After years of commenting on JW Survey I was invited by one of that channels commenters to check out beroeans.net. After checking it out I started commenting there. While commenting on beroeans.net if I didn’t agree with a point of view expressed in one of their articles then sometimes a couple of their commenters got nasty, and insulting. And sometimes on beroeans.net even when debating others in very civil debates editors on beroeans.net would tell us to move on, and not to discuss that topic anymore. That’s something that NEVER happened on Lloyd’s Survey channel. Finally the owner of beroeans.net sent me a private email demanding I change my tone or get bounced off his site. Well that was it for me there. Since my tone was fine, and it was his brown nose followers that were insulting me I told the site’s owner it wasn’t my tone but my ideas that were obviously his objection. So I said I’m not coming back.

I also commented on christianforums.com for a while. That is until christianforums.com censored me and told me one of its editors must question me, to ascertain if I believe in the Trinity doctrine, before the site would allow me to comment further. If I didn’t believe in the Trinity doc they wouldn’t let me comment anymore. Again, that kind of crap was never done on Lloyd’s channel. So that was it for christianforums.com for me. I wasn’t about to say I believed or didn’t believe in anything to satisfy their administrators. That sounded like being in the backroom with three elders asking if you believe in the “faithful and discreet slave.” What’s the difference? I see none. Again, that kind of crap never happened on Lloyd’s channel.

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Why Saved Christians Should Not Feel Sorry for Those God Leaves Behind

At the end of this post I’ll direct you to another website to view evidence that drives home these points. Spend time looking at it. If so, the ideas in this post should be evident to you.

People who God does not save want to do things their own way. We all want that. But they want it to the exclusion of following God’s ways. And that’s why he doesn’t save them.

Oh, many of them might claim, “If I really knew there was a god I would follow him.” Think about that statement for one minute. Don’t you know if that was true God would make sure those people knew he exists? After all, he makes sure we know he exists. If God knew they would follow him he would see they knew that also. Because he is not partial. He is not favoring one personality over another. God only wants things done his way because he is God. And since God sees the future he knows what we will do.

Most people who do follow God do not get upset when ideas about God are shared or even debated with them. They talk about the ideas and might even discuss whether an idea is true or not. For them there is nothing to get excited about, because they view such discussions as sharing ideas.

Some people, who don’t want to follow God, get upset when ideas about God are shared. Why? Because they don’t want to hear them. Why not? Aren’t those just ideas to them also? No they are not. So why don’t they want to hear it unless it’s an idea they agree with? Because right away, even though you might just share an idea, they think, “Stop telling ME what to do.” Or, “You cannot tell me what to do, think or believe.”

The fact is when we’re sharing ideas we are not telling anyone what to believe or do. So if they are saying that to us really they are thinking that thought about anyone that doesn’t believe what they do, while sharing ideas about God with them. That’s one of the reasons people killed Christ. It was because of his ideas about God that he shared with them.

Most people like this won’t admit you must think like them to share such thoughts. But that’s really what they want. The reason they want that is because their belief is that everyone has a right to believe whatever he wants about God, and do whatever he wants with that belief. But while that thought might sound good to you, scripturally it’s not true. It’s grounded in the United States Constitution, but it isn’t in the Bible. God grants a privilege but not a right to believe ideas that go against his authority. And most people who get mad when you just share biblical ideas with them know that. And that’s why they say you are trying to assert your will over theirs. Because they know biblically God asserts his will over all others, and they attach that thought to what you share. Even if you don’t bring it up it’s present in their mind.

At the end of this article I’ll send you to another website. The purpose I’m sending you there is to view some comments from commenter on this other website. I didn’t view all of those, just a half dozen or so. But most of the ones I read caused a thought to come to mind. I thought how Satan first came up with an idea not to serve God. And then once that idea spread among angels those that followed him might have sat around, like the commenters on this other site, telling God’s angels:

Stop telling us what to believe.

Stupid, your way is not the only way.

We don’t need to hear that.

I love our leader the Devil; or the Devil is the most loving, and we should all choose what we want.

Notice how that thought is expressed over and over again on this site I’ll send you to. However, their comments are directed towards me, not an angel. And I didn’t even need to tell them that they should follow God to receive such comments. I didn’t even share a scriptural thought with them. Instead, someone turned over an article I wrote to the host of the site. And he spent over an hour venting about the article I wrote. In most of his rant he misrepresented what I said and believe. Why did he do it? For the reasons I stated above.

In the article I listed him as an ex-Jehovah’s Witness who most likely does not accept Christ as God. I wrote that after viewing his videos. So that wound him up for a whole hour, even though he admitted that he isn’t a Christian in the video. For him someone saying that about him was not just an idea, whether true or not true. For him it was, “You cannot tell me what to believe!” And he states that in his video. To him, me telling you, I don’t believe this guy is a Christian, meant STOP TELLING ME WHAT TO DO!!!!

Furthermore, the fellow in the video admitted he’s an antichrist. Yet because he referred to a rather large Christian website that I cited in my article, then he felt compelled to tell the owners of that site to keep doing what they are doing, teaching Christ is God. And why would he say that since he hates the God of the Bible, and he stated he believes the Bible is untrue? Because his thought is really you (other website) leave us alone, and I’ll leave you alone. Let us all believe what we want. Don’t tell me what I should believe. When the fact is neither I nor the fellow owning the Christian site would tell this guy to believe anything. We just share ideas, that’s all.

The fellow in the video misrepresented one of my articles, and it’s possible those commenters bought into his lies when misrepresenting it. But I don’t think accepting his lies is what caused their responses. I believe the ideas I write about in this article caused their responses. And notice how some praised the one in the video who is an admitted antichrist. That’s what really made me think of what it must have been like for Satan, and might still be like for Satan. (He’s the most loving fellow). Really? Check out his demeanor. I don’t see that as loving.

*Caution: The guy who is in the video admits he’s an antichrist. So if it bothers you to view an antichrist rant for an hour then just note the comments from his followers. I’ll post the article that set him off. And below that I post his video.

His Video:

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What Is the Meaning of the Faithful and Discreet Slave Story?

The message Christ gave at Matthew 24:36 thru Matthew 25:30 was to convey two ideas. And those two points were the only reason he told those stories. Christ was explaining that his disciples will not know the time of his return. He even said they will not expect it when it happens. That idea demolishes the false concept that Christ gave a sign in this monologue to show his followers when his return would be eminent, e.g. a sign of the last days. No such sign exists. *1 And more importantly, his second message was that a favorable consequence will come to disciples that remain faithful to him, contrasting that to the unfavorable consequence coming to unfaithful disciples. Two ideas: 1. You won’t know when I (Christ) will return, 2. and if you are not faithful you won’t receive the reward I promised you.

Christ merely used different vocations to illustrate those two points. The points of his stories were not tied to the vocation of the subjects in those stories. In his faithful and discreet slave story Christ merely used the vocation of elders in Christian congregations. The fact that he used men appointed by him that are feeding his sheep is irrelevant to the points he was making.

How do I know? For two reasons. First, because every person in those illustrations who receives a favorable reward is part of Christ’s anointed church. And Christ said he is their only teacher, men are not their teachers or leaders. Therefore Christians are not to follow men. And the second reason I’m sure of this is because Christ set that story right in the middle of other stories telling these same two messages.

When you read about the faithful slave who could become an evil slave, and what happens to him if he becomes evil, then it’s clear the message is the same. Also, note in that story the slave didn’t know when his master would return. He even thought the master was delaying. Which is the exact message in all those other stories. That story means nothing more than the two men in the field, the two women at the grinding mill, the home owner that was robbed, the 10 virgins, the 3 servants. All have the same themes. Look those scriptures up; or you can find those here: http://debatescripture.org/index.php/2020/01/22/why-you-are-not-a-real-christian-according-to-jehovahs-witnessess/

*1 Christ didn’t give a sign of any “last days.” But he did give a sign of his actual return. That sign will be seen in heaven (the sky).

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How Did Watchtower Get Its First Churches?

There is a book entitled I Was a Watchtower Slave written by an ex-WT zone overseer back in the 40s or 50s. The guy that wrote it said he was working at Bethel in Germany when he was just 19 or 20 years old. He claims in Germany, while he was at Bethel, WT started taking over churches. If I remember correctly he said they did this around 1920 in Germany. He believed they tried it in Germany before the USA to see if it would be successful. This is how he claims they took control of churches:

According to this man’s claim they sent German Bethel members out to German churches subscribing to Watchtower publications. These Bethel reps then reported what was going on inside congregations using Watchtower publications. If those German congregations using the WT literature were not in step with WT teachings, then those Bethel members sent into those congregations would count them as apostate, and attempt to lead members out of those churches to follow them. He wrote when he was about 20 years old he went into a German congregation, told everyone there that he was from Watchtower, and that everyone with Watchtower must stand up and leave that church right then with him. He led a bunch out and declared those left as apostates, terminating that church’s relationship with the Watchtower organization.

Later this fellow came to the USA as a pioneer, zone overseer, and eventual Bethel worker. He said WT in the USA essentially did the same thing it did in Germany but used more kid gloves. What WT did in the USA is send its appointed company servants from Bethel into congregations, gave them authority over elders, and then removed elders from any assignments they had if they didn’t agree fully with WT policy . Things like turning in field service reports to WT headquarters. The author compared Americans then who were in churches using Watchtower publications to cowboys, meaning they were more independent in their thinking than compliant Germans associated with WT back then. So he said in America the men sent in to churches were older than those in Germany, and their tactics were not as harsh. He believed WT didn’t think the strong tactics used in Germany would have worked here in the USA. But he also said the tactics WT used in the USA were very effective, claiming all the elders that were stripped of their work assignments eventually left the org WT was building. Thereby leaving Watchtower with complete control in churches using its literature.

That’s how this author claimed WT took control of churches, in Germany and the USA…back in the 1920s and early 1930s. Prior to Watchtower taking over these churches they were independent organizations merely affiliated with the magazine company. Another interesting point this guy brought out was the spying done inside Bethel in Germany, and in the USA. He was invited to Bethel USA by Rutherford. But he said he didn’t want to work there. When he was there he said people working close to him were the type to turn you in for any supposed infraction or contrary belief. He said it was the same when he worked Bethel Germany.

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Why Are So Many Ex Jehovah’s Witnesses Creating YouTube Channels, and What Do They Teach?

So many ex-JWs still believe Christ is not God after they leave Watchtower. The larger websites run by ex-JWs teaching that, which I know about are:

  1. Beroean Pickets YouTube with over 13,000 subscribers, most of those appearing to buy into Eric Wilson’s teachings. Eric denies Christ is God. And beroeans.net is also run by Eric and other ex-JWs who deny Christ is God.
  2. JWSurvey, run by ex-JWs who not only deny Christ’s deity but are also atheists; and of course Lloyd Evans YouTube channel, John Cedars YouTube. Lloyd is the ex-JW who started JWSurvey. Some of his followers on YouTube still believe in God. However, I believe many do not since Lloyd teaches believing in God is a form of ignorance mankind engages in because he is afraid of death. Lloyd’s YouTube channel has over 79,000 subscribers. I suspect many of his subscribers are atheists like Lloyd.
  3. I wrote in to Ex JW Critical Thinker, on YouTube, and asked if any of the administrators there were anointed or contacted by God. I received no response. They have 29,000 followers.
  4. Then there is Kim and Mikey with over 30,000 subscribers. I only see them knock Watchtower. I never saw them teach about God, that is unless it was for the purpose of knocking Watchtower.
  5. And what about JW Facts? Is that guy an atheist? Who knows. But if he remained Christian, don’t you think some people down here on earth would know that, considering the popularity of his site and how long it’s been around?
  6. Telltale Ex JW on YouTube is an ex-Jehovah’s Witness who is now an atheist. He has 238,000 subscribers. What does he do? Knock Watchtower and other Bible teachers. Most sites created by ex-Jws exist to disparage Watchtower, and not to preach Christ or any other gospel.

Another factor which probably contributes to the existence of these sites is money, and fame by gathering a following. All those sites are monetized, which means the owners get paid by having you view their content; and some of the sites also have links where you can donate your money to them. While YouTube sites are free; sites like this one cost almost nothing; and it also costs very little to produce videos.

However, their pretense to exist is to help the poor JW people who have been misled by Watchtower or people who, these sites claim, have been severely mentally damaged by WT’s policies. And they also claim to exist to warn others about Watchtower. Almost none of them claim to exist to help other people know God. And the fact they don’t exist to help others know God is proven by their content.

Eric’s Beroean Pickets YouTube and beroeans.net being exceptions to these other websites’ professed purpose for existence. Eric is in it to teach Bible scriptures. Yet Eric is also in it for the money. He asks for donations and monetizes his sites.

Though teaching scripture Eric still doesn’t know who Christ is, nor does he believe any humans go to heaven. And he has some other strange beliefs that appear only he made up, like God will not judge anyone of eternal damnation until he brings every sinner to a perfect state like Adam and Eve were in without sin. Eric teaches that idea as he claims there has to be a level playing field before God makes such judgments. Yet that idea is clearly contradicted by Christ’s own words, which Eric knows-see Matthew 25:31-46.

So how do we find the TRUTH about God? A brief answer is God has to give you his truth. So you don’t find God’s truth, it finds you. It doesn’t come from some other person teaching it to you, or YOU looking up what someone else thinks about it. That is one of the fallacies about Eric’s way of teaching, for it misleads those thousands who follow him. He bases most of his teachings on research, such as researching the correct definition of an ancient Greek or Hebrew word that is used in a particular scripture. That’s not how Christ teaches his truth to his church members today. And that’s not how Christ taught his church when he was on earth.

But how dangerous is religious propaganda or atheism? And exactly how does Christ reach us so that we don’t follow men, but only him? Religious propaganda surely has contributed to atheism, as surely as clouds contribute to rain. That fact is clearly seen by what I’ve shared above. Watchtower engages in religious propaganda. Its teachings are full of it. And most of the owners of the sites above held positions of authority within the Watchtower organization. They were included among its teachers. They were what other denominations would call pastors. And some of these worked at Watchtower’s worldwide headquarters. Yet almost all of them became atheists after their experience inside the Jehovah’s Witnesses organization. I believe the only ones named above that didn’t become atheists were Eric Wilson and his bunch.

Yet these site owners are few compared to the hundreds of thousands of people who follow them. How many of their followers are atheists? I suspect a great many. And I suspect most of their followers used to be Jehovah’s Witnesses. For more info see: http://debatescripture.org/index.php/2020/10/24/you-cannot-teach-ignorant-people-to-accept-another-point-of-view/

Yet despite all this going on we can have confidence that everything is happening according to God’s plan. Humanity is being sifted. Recently I did find an ex-JW YouTube site that is run by two ex-JWs who teach scriptures and understand the simplest truth that I believe all heavenly bound Christians know, which is Christ is God. The site is Jude 3 & Laura 2 – YouTube

Update 5/1/2021:

It appears Eric Wilson, of Beroean Pickets YouTube, has come to the realization that some humans will be judged worthy of eternal damnation because of what they did or failed to do in this world, a 180 degree turnabout from his previous teaching about the necessity of a level playing field (e.g. the necessity of perfection for all humans before that judgment is made by Christ). Good for Eric. See his recent video here: https://youtu.be/D6t04qhfEPA

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What Did Jesus Mean by Born Again?

Born again does not mean being acceptable to Christ as a Christian. The term Christian was first used to mean any person who follows Christ. Certainly those in the New World, on earth, will follow Christ. When Christ spoke about born again he used a metaphor, the wind. And Christ said that people don’t know where the wind comes from or where it goes. He said that because the wind is invisible. He used that metaphor because he was implying that born again people will have another type of body that can go where humans cannot, into the invisible dimensions he called heaven. And people on earth would not see where they went.

Paul said baptism in Holy Spirit was only a token (sign), like a partial payment, of what was to come-see 2 Corinthians 1: 21,22 and Ephesians 4:30. Being born again with a body that can travel to the dimensions of heaven is what Paul meant by what was to come, in “the day of redemption.” Being baptized in Holy Spirit means a person is chosen by God. But being born again means those people actually receive those special bodies-per Christ’s words to Nicodemus.

Another thing I think JWs get wrong is saying (what they call) spiritual bodies are not material in nature. How would they know that? Scriptures don’t claim it. Scriptures state those bodies have substance. Those bodies might be made of elements mankind is not aware of. There is no way to tell what they are made of this side of heaven.

Christ’s Words

John chapter 3 :

3Jesus replied, “Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.a

4“How can a man be born when he is old?” Nicodemus asked. “Can he enter his mother’s womb a second time to be born?”

5Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. 6Flesh is born of flesh, but spirit is born of the Spirit. 7Do not be amazed that I said, ‘Youb must be born again.’ 8The wind blows where it wishes. You hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”

9“How can this be?” Nicodemus asked.

10“You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and you do not understand these things? 11Truly, truly, I tell you, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, and yet you people do not accept our testimony.

12If I have told you about earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you about heavenly things?

For More Information See

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Why Do Some People Who Are Hurt by Cults Remain Religious?

My Comment on John Cedars’ YouTube Video Posted 1/16/2021

Having previously been a regular commenter on Lloyd Evans'(aka John Cedars) site JW Survey for a number of years; a JW for about 40 years; and as a current Christian ex-JW, I can answer the caller’s question directly, without interpretations through a third party. When Lloyd started his answer he came closest to what the real answer is. When he said ex-JWs who are still Christian believe in God because they don’t associate God with Watchtower. But here is where he went wrong. Most real Christians who know anything about what Christ really taught know Christians don’t follow religion. Real Christians only follow Christ. We know Christ told us to do that. And Christ said, weeds and wheat (Christians) will grow together, and apostles wrote quite a bit about Christian apostasy. Lloyd was also correct about people having a mind that wants to know God. But that applies to all people, not just Christians. And it’s a provable fact. Because what you call religion has dominated the world since the beginning. Wait until you’re dying, and you’ll recognize that, if you don’t already.

Along with the human mind existing with its desire to know God the main reason why Christians accept what you call religion, which is not what I call it, I call it God, is because of the evidence. Which is exactly what atheists claim to have. While actually atheists have zero evidence to support their positions. However, testimonials provided by Christians today and in historical records include eyewitness evidence to the existence of godly miracles, including personal contacts by God. Through such testimonials evidence that God exists is present today.

While atheists can provide nothing but conjecture to support their belief. They attempt to point to science. Yet science cannot explain their position, as science teaches energy cannot be created or destroyed. (See www.thoughtco.com/energy-definition-and-examples-2698976 ). Therefore, science has no answer, zip, zero, none for how all this energy got here in the first place.

The part about cognitive dissonance that Lloyd brought up I see as a bunch of poppycock. Most, and maybe all, JWs that left Watchtower and remained Christian did not go through some sort of weak protection mechanism called cognitive dissonance. While some ex-JWs on sites like this (John Cedars YouTube channel) cry about that, I doubt most of those ever experienced cognitive dissonance because of Watchtower either. I know I never have, and Lloyd does not come across as he ever has; although I cannot attest to any mental condition he’s experienced. As for myself, it was just a belief I held for a number of years that WT was telling the truth about many things, that changed when I discovered it wasn’t. There was no cognitive dissonance attached to either side of that belief, where I attempted to hold onto or justify my previous belief in WT’s teachings. I look at it no differently than I access other ideas told me by other people that prove to be untrue. I suspect most ex-JWs do also.

For those wishing to know more about many Bible doctrines Watchtower got wrong you are welcome to visit my site debatescripture.org . So the shortest answer to the caller’s question is we ex-JW Christians follow God because we follow evidence. Not just biblical evidence, God still contacts people today, and their testimonials are part of that evidence. The fact that you don’t believe us is something God allows for now. Non-belief is prophetic (2Peter chapter 3). But your non-belief has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that evidence exists. Here is a question I think you should consider. Why would God prove his existence to people who don’t want to follow him?

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Elders Going Beyond WT Disciplinary Guidelines

Some of the elders are opinionated and go beyond WT guideline. When I was a new Witness a young elder started commending me on my fine service and zeal, but then he said, “but your wife doesn’t comment at the Watchtower.” Then I answered, “I know, and I spoke to her about it.” His reply was, “cut her allowance.” The very next Watchtower study he stopped calling on me. He was the WT conductor. And whenever the service overseer had a part on the stage he would never call on me either. These two did that as long as I stayed in that congregation, about a year longer. I was even appointed MS there, but that didn’t stop the practice from these two elders.

A sister told me this story, but I believe her. I used to work with her, and we were in the same congregation. She said that on a shepherding call that she and her husband received because her husband was physically violent towards her, then the presiding overseer, COBE, asked her, “but did you deserve it?” This was a different congregation than the one I was writing about in that first paragraph. This COBE was also the WT study conductor. And after he had called on me freely, during the WT study for several years, he abruptly stopped. I think because I was in a university. I reported him and several other elders in to the WT Society. I had seen that behavior in three congregations, in three separate counties. Also others reported to me it had happened to them, including an elder and his son in law in the same area. So I reported everyone I knew had engaged in the practice, from the three congregations, and gave the names of a couple elders who told me they were aware of it.

But every elder I confronted, that was guilty, lied about it. However, one elder that I questioned to see what he knew, that I didn’t accuse of participating, said these exact words, “That’s what we used to do, but we don’t do it anymore.” Well he was lying there also, because I know he was aware it was going on then. In that congregation his brother in law was one of the guilty parties. And while I was a victim of the practice I gave a talk on the school. This guy who claimed he didn’t know anything about the practice going on, at that time, came and sat right up front, in the middle of the stage, right in front of me. And he came up there just for my talk. Leaving his family seated half way back in the hall, walking back to his seat after my talk. While up front he started making these facial expressions like he’s a tough guy, like I’ll drag you off the stage if you say anything about this now. You see I had already informed 4 new elders sent into the congregation from a neighboring one. And I had spoken to the guilty elders to see if they wanted to admit their behavior and apologize , and we could get that behind us.

So these innocent elders who had been sent over knew about it, his brother in law and other guilty elders there knew about it, but he didn’t? That was a lie. And he didn’t want me going to the circuit overseer. Which he verbalized. Thing is, I didn’t care what he wanted. The circuit overseer was told, and the CO believed me. So did 4 other elders sent into that congregation.

But another point I’d like to reiterate is every guilty elder I confronted lied about it. And I saw the practice going on in three separate CA counties, LA, Orange, San Bernardino. The congregations were between 60-100 miles apart. Now in each incident I saw this behavior taking place the elders were even too chicken sh** to talk to the persons they were zeroing in on about any type of misconduct. And why would that be? Because their reasons were so petty. As stated above the first time it happened to me is because my wife didn’t comment at the WT, even though she was active and commented at the book study regularly.

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Why Won’t Jehovah’s Witnesses Listen to You?

Winston in one of his videos on YouTube’s channel Watchtower Examination stated he believes governing body member Anthony Morris calculated at least 6,000,000 out of the over 8,000,000 Witnesses would not care and still follow him for making an incorrect statement, in an address Anthony Morris gave on the Watchtower TV channel. I don’t think Mr. Morris even calculated a number. Because he already knew the number is so much greater than what Winston said. You see Winston must not fully realize why Jehovah’s Witnesses will not listen to him; or why they will follow Watchtower, even if WT gives wrong information (even about the Bible), and he, Winston, gives them correct information (even about the Bible).

I wrote him:

As a used to be JW, active for over 40 years, I can assure you (Winston) that a lot more than 6,000,000 of the over 8,000,000 will not care what Tony Morris says, even if Tony Morris says things that are incorrect. The real figure of those who don’t care is likely more than 99% of Witnesses. You see almost every Witness I knew over the 40 years of attending meetings in 6 congregations would accept practically anything the GB would put out.

And the ideas individual (JW) members wouldn’t accept, like the GB’s teaching not to engage in higher education, they would, if at all possible, keep to themselves. That is they might only disclose those things to people who were extremely close, those who they believed would not pass that information to anyone else.

Jehovah’s Witnesses are afraid of being turned in for sinning by another JW. Turned in to who? To their congregational elders who the Watchtower obligates to investigate a sin. And not believing the Governing Body to a JW is not following God (sinning). And Jehovah’s Witnesses are afraid of getting kicked out of their organization. To a JW getting kicked out is one of the worst things that could happen to them.

Plus before almost every JW is baptized they are conditioned to accept being a JW is the only way to serve God. So these two things are what gives WT and its leaders their power. First and foremost is the Witness belief becoming a JW is the ONLY way to serve God, and second the Witness fear that way to serve God might be removed by their own action, even if that action is denying any teaching from the governing body.

Notice this recent reply that was directed to me on another site. Pay close attention to the “emphatic” statement the CO (standing for circuit overseer) made:

Highlighted reply Unassigned Vlog 11 hours ago. From the YouTube site Unassigned Vlog:

Yep we had a WT slid across to us in an elders meeting that said the same thing, accept the BS or get the DF. After raising a couple simple questions that poke holes in the FDS being the GB, the CO said, “You will never accept it.” I replied, “Because it isn’t true.” He said emphatically, “It doesn’t matter if its true.” This last statement goes against my very core in becoming a JW. (John 4:23. 24)

END OF THE COMMENTER’S REPLY

MY THOUGHTS ON THE COMMENT:

That circuit overseer said, “IT DOESN’T MATTER IF IT’S TRUE.” If What’s true? If the GB is what Christ was describing in his “faithful and discreet slave” parable. And the circuit overseer’s statement has been proven true. Watchtower has defined who the FDS is several different ways already. And did it lose followers when changing their opinion? No! They didn’t because of those two reasons I list above. All JWs are conditioned to believe those two things. The only ones that don’t are people who lied and said they did to please parents who expected them to get baptized as a JW. Either they told that lie when they were baptized, or like me they came to believe the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses and the Jehovah’s Witness organization are not what they claim to be. Oh, there is another group also, those that decide not to serve God.

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Contacted by God

I’ve heard of supernatural experiences from friends before. I always discounted those, by taking my friends’ words with a grain of salt. I imagined there might be another explanation for what they saw that differed from their assessment of the facts they told me. Because that’s how I was I believe most people who have never seen something that is undeniably supernatural will take the same position I used to take.

I have verbally told parts of this story to others. But I never wrote it down to post before today. And I never told the whole story, or even as much of it as I write now. There’s just too much to tell. How do you describe every detail of an experience? You just don’t. So why do I post my experience now? Because a commenter on another website asked to hear about it. So I decided to tell her and post that comment here also.

In writing to me on that other site she said:

Now, I can look back to when I was 11 and I spoke to Jesus from my heart, and I heard him answer me. I also felt a tingling rush and much love sweep over me. I have always kept that treasured in my heart and only just started sharing it very recently. (I’m 60 now.) ….
It was almost immediately after that experience when I was 11, that JWs began studying with my family. It was a good thing for me. It may have saved my life, even. So I have no regrets about becoming JW. Do you experience Spirit this way? I would love to hear more about your own experiences.

I responded to her request with this:

My first wife died on July 26, 2009, one day before my birthday. She suffered a stroke and died while a patient in a hospital. She was the nicest person I have ever known, not because she was my wife, but factually she was the nicest. She was a lot nicer than me.

About five years before she died I had a dream. It was different than other dreams of mine, because it’s the only one I ever let affect a decision of mine. Even though reading this article that decision will seem insignificant to you, to me, at the time, it wasn’t. Even though the decision was just to choose what interior color our new house would be painted. It meant something to me. More than just a wall color.

When I had the dream I didn’t believe God contacted people in our day. I believed what Watchtower taught us, that he doesn’t. Yet this dream scared me; I didn’t want it to come true. And I thought it just might be different from other nightmares and really happen (even though at that time I didn’t think such things happened). But I thought I might be able to stop it from happening if I changed something in my life that I foresaw in that dream. It was a just in case thought you know. Because me, I didn’t believe in real premonitions. Not in our day.

Our History

We were married for 32 years when she died. Other than going to restaurants and Jehovah’s Witness conventions, or to vacation spots in San Diego, our favorite hobby was buying newly constructed houses and fixing them up. But about ten years before her death we lost our money due to our failing business. And so we moved from a very affluent part of CA to a part that is primarily a middle class area in CA. It is about 100 miles away from South Orange County, and our old neighborhood in Laguna Niguel.

We kept the business going for a couple years from there but then shut it down. I was already 49 years old. She was 48. Since we’d essentially lost everything of material value I needed another source of income. My wife had only worked part time in our own business since we married. So after closing the business neither of us had a source of income. I decided to become an attorney or public school music teacher. I eventually chose teacher because I assumed it would cost less than becoming an attorney. I knew I would be well into my 50s when I finished college to enter into either profession.

So I entered a junior college. And I got a job as a security guard. When I applied for it I asked the company’s owner if I could do my homework on the job, and he said yes. I worked nights and weekends and went to school during the day. Because the job didn’t pay much my wife got a job at K-Mart. Together we made enough to get by. At the time we were both faithful Jehovah’s Witnesses. My wife remained one until she died. I still believed in Watchtower then too. But I began to view it differently several years later. I guess it started about three years after her death.

The First Contact


But about five years before she died I had a dream. The dream was of me in a house that we would have built some time later, a few years or so later. I know she lived in the home we had built for three years before she died. The dream started with me standing next to a bed, in a bedroom, inside a house I had never been in. The bed was a high one, and the framing on it with its headboard was dark brown wood. (For years as we’d furnish new homes my wife and I always picked out more modern looking furniture, and we always chose light woods like white ash). But this wood was very dark, and the style was not modern. I looked at the room and there was sunlight coming through its two windows. There was a tall armoire against the wall opposite the bed, and it was made of dark brown wood also. I walked out of the bedroom which opened to an alcove that gave way to a living room on the right a dining room on the left. Both those rooms were separated by a walkway leading to a kitchen.

But instead of going directly to the kitchen I went over to a wall on the far side of the living room, and I began to stare up at something on that wall. The only thing I could never remember about this dream is what I was staring up at. But as I was a color superimposed itself on the wall, but just around the object I was staring at. The color was a very light grey with just a hint of bluish green in it.

And that’s what caused me to let this dream affect a decision I made in real life. You see, when we finally had a house built we chose the interior color that we saw inside the model home of our contractor. But then later my wife said, “let’s change the color.” I said no. You see I thought she might pick that light grey that I saw in the dream. Even though in the dream the color only appeared around the object I was gazing at, I assumed it might indicate the interior color of the house in that dream. And I didn’t want it to come true. I thought if I could change that I could change the dream’s outcome, if it proved to be a premonition.

As I walked through the living room/dining room area I noticed both those rooms were only partially furnished, and I consciously thought to myself, “There isn’t a lot of furniture in these two rooms.” (Remember my wife and I used to buy new houses and decorate them-so this lack of furniture got my attention; because in the dream I was living in this house). I then walked into the kitchen. The kitchen and another eating area were together as one big room. Half the room was a large kitchen, and half was another large eating area, as large as the formal dining room. This eating area was on the left, the kitchen on the right. But the room itself was just one big room. So I walked past the table in that eating area, walked over to the window, and looked out at the view. I could see most of the desert valley from there.

One of my sons was either washing his dish or preparing a meal on the kitchen island, and he said, “Hi daddy.” I answered back, “Hi Scott.” Then I looked down a hallway that exited the kitchen, on the opposite side from where I’d entered it. As I looked down that dark hallway the purpose of the dream became clear. For the first time an extremely strong emotion overwhelmed me. It was sadness as I thought, “Some of our children live in the bedrooms down that hallway, but my wife is not with us.” And I thought, “None of us are with her. And she’s not coming back.”

The next thing I knew I was outside in the yard, right outside the bedroom that I was in when the dream started. It was our bedroom. I reached down and turned on the water to an irrigation drip line. I looked down at the view of the whole valley. I cut a couple weeds with a hoe as I looked at the front yard. And the dream was over.

Why do I believe the dream is significant?

Before we ever had our house built I felt it was a strange dream. At that time I didn’t believe God contacts people today. After we moved in our new home I saw it was the home in that dream. I told my family I had a dream I was living in this house years before it was built. I told that to my mother, and also I told her my wife wasn’t with us. The layout and interior of our new home matched that of the dream home exactly. And it’s design and floorplan is extremely unique. My wife and I used to run through every model and construction site in our old neighborhood in South Orange County, both of track and custom homes. But we never saw a home’s interior that looked anything like this one.

And once my wife died our house was furnished just like the house in that dream. I picked our bed. But she picked that armoire and brought it home without me seeing it before she brought it home. Both objects were exactly like in the dream, and we placed both in our bedroom in the same places. We never owned an armoire before that. About a month before she died we took almost all the furniture out of the dining room. You see we had furniture on lay away for the living room. And we had the dining room furnished really nicely. But the wood in the dining room would have been a shade or two darker than the living room furniture we were going to receive. So I told her, “Why don’t we move that into the kitchen area, and then put new furniture on lay away for the dining room, to better match the wood colors. ” That we did. That left both rooms scarcely furnished one month before she died. And just a month after she died both were fully furnished.

So many things I had no control over matched exactly, that water spigot outside the wall of our bedroom, in the exact same location; the view was the same also; the timing, because our house only had sparse furnishings in both living and dining rooms for just a month before she died. That’s the only time they were furnished like that. A week or two after she died my sister went to K-Mart where my wife worked. My sister brought sympathy cards saying a lot of nice things about her. K Mart employees also sent my family over two hundred dollars, and they sent the statue of an angel that was light grey with a hint of blue-green, the exact color I saw superimposed on part of the living room wall in that dream. I wasn’t thinking about that then, but when my sister gave me the statue I put it on a table, up against that wall I stared at when I saw that color superimposing itself on that part of the wall. And today that angel sits atop a piece of furniture, in the spot I was looking up at in the dream.

She Dies

She had high blood pressure as long as I’d known her. But she was on medication for it. However, she developed a hoarseness because of one medication, so her doctor prescribed a new one. It didn’t work. My wife didn’t communicate that to me, and I didn’t find out until at least a year later. All that time her pressure was dangerously high (over 200).

I ended up taking her to doctors with the final result being her admission into a hospital. I remember when we decided she would go in, she told me, “I’m afraid.” And I said, “What are you afraid of?” She said, “I don’t want to die.” Then I answered, “You’re not going to die.” But then, for the first time I did tell her she wasn’t with me in that dream I had, and why I didn’t want to change the interior color of our home. Still I didn’t believe it was going to happen, even though almost everything else I had seen in the dream had already come true. Everything except the fact that she was gone. And that color superimposing itself on the living room wall.

She was in the hospital for two days. They brought her blood pressure down upon admission. The second day she had a stroke that killed her. After she died I knew the dream couldn’t have been coincidental. There were just too many details in it that came true. And not one detail in it failed to come true. Even that statue showing up that I randomly placed against the same wall that its color superimposed itself on in that dream. To me, logically, the amount of details that I saw come true were beyond chance. I couldn’t reconcile that it was coincidental.

That’s when I knew I was contacted by someone that lives in the future, not just could see the future but lives there. To me that could be the only answer, because how else could he have told me such minute details about my life, including almost the exact day of my wife’s death, five years or more before it happened? I know I could not foresee the future. It was shown to me by someone else.

Later I reasoned out why this first dream was shown to me. It’s because I’m a skeptic. After my wife died I asked God to show her to me in my dreams. And being a skeptic, if I didn’t have proof that he did that, I would have believed I just had those dreams all on my own, even though I asked for them in prayer. So God showed me details leading to her death, and after the final dream he showed me a vision of something representing himself, while I was a wake. And the object that I saw looked as solid as anything else I’d ever seen. But it could float and go through walls.

More Dreams/ One Vision While Awake


In the days after she died, before I went to sleep, I’d pray to God to see her in a dream. About five times I did that, and it happened four times. The first time she and I were in what looked like a park, and there were other people enjoying themselves in it. The third time we were in a large parking lot that was empty with a couple people going into a large building with no name. We talked. I wanted to know what it was like being dead, because I had no recollection of me dying. So I asked her saying, “But you were dead?” Then she just looked puzzled, as if she couldn’t say anything about the experience.

Then we walked into that large building. There was a smaller room in the front, with a lady behind an ice cream counter. We told her what we wanted. She gave it to us. But we were not charged. It was free. And we seemed to know it would be free. We both knew we were in the New World that scriptures speak of. And I knew she had come back to life. But there was no pain attached to the thought of her death anymore. Not like there still is. No pain at all. In the dream I just thought of it as an experience, her death. In those dreams I had after her death, up to this point, the over riding emotional feeling I had was contentment. There was nothing to worry about there. And there was no pain when thinking about bad things from the past.


I’ll describe the last dream now. The last dream was different than these others. All the other dreams began with me on the earth, even though I was in the New World. In the last dream I was standing up in the air, while I was floating down to earth. I wasn’t very high off the ground. I wasn’t moving my legs at all, but my whole body was floating down at an angle, and moving fairly quickly. I was coming down into that park that I mentioned above, and my wife was standing up on the ground looking at me approach her. As I looked down at her I experienced fear. I was thinking this I thought to myself as I looked at her, “You are dead, I’m not suppose to talk to dead people.” So I got scared and yelled Jehovah really loud. As soon as I did I was pulled backwards, back up towards the sky at the same angle I was descending in. I never reached the ground before I was pulled back. And I was jerked really fast. Right after I was snatched back I woke.

As soon as I woke I saw an object hovering over my chest. And as soon as I saw it, it moved from over me and hovered in the air about 7 feet from me. As it did I thought, “You are the one that’s been putting those dreams in my mind.” It seemed to hover there so that I would contemplate that thought. It stayed there about ten seconds as I looked at it and had that thought. It seemed to be reading my mind, knowing what I was thinking. In that way I believe it was delivering its final message. The message of YES.

It looked kind of like a thick banner made of wool about 4 feet wide and 3 feet tall made to hang on a wall, that my wife owned. It was the same size and color of that banner, when the length of the wall banner is doubled over to hang on a curtain rod. My wife used to sometimes cover herself with it when she’d lay down. Her mom had given her this piece from New York City. It has Jehovah’s name written all over it many times, with many additional names attached to Jehovah in Hebrew along with their English translations, like Jehovah Nissi-God my Banner; Jehovah Shammah-God Is Present; Jehovah Raphe-God Heals. Those are just some of the names, there are many more. But every name starts with Jehovah.

This object that I saw looked just as solid as everything else in the room. It looked like that wall banner, but it didn’t have any writing on it. It sort of looked like a thick curtain with slight pleats, smooth rolling ones, no creases. And parts of it glowed a reddish orange glow. But the light coming from it didn’t light the room. After about ten seconds of what seemed to be a telepathic reading of my mind it vanished up through the ceiling. While it hovered I just kept thinking, you are the one that gave me those dreams. When it moved it did so really fast, split second fast.

What does it mean? Why did it happen?

At first I didn’t know. I wondered, why would God contact me? Who am I for him to contact? I knew that part of the reason for the contact was to comfort me, to let me know everything will eventually be alright. But in time I knew that wasn’t the main reason. The main reason is that God was telling me that I’m his chosen son. And because I am his chosen son everything will be alright because he will make it that way, for me. And so he showed me coming down from heaven and pulled me back up when I got scared and called him.

“….but you received the Spirit of sonship, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children. And if we are children, then we are heirs: heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ—if indeed we suffer with Him, so that we may also be glorified with Him…” Romans 8:15-17

“‘And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams; Acts 2:17